I have just seen a post on the RMC site where a member was talking about going to France to 'fill-in' a water with pellets designed to be eaten by ruminants, pigs, sheep, whatever.

This post horrified me , and I wanted to put a response there but at present seem unable to.

These sorts of pellets ARE NOT designed to be eaten by fish, and could be very harmful to carp, causing digestive problems etc. If 'filled in' as threatened it is a sure-fire way to kill the fishing stone-dead.

If anyone is going to my French lakes and is intending using these sort of pellets just to save a few measly quid then can they leave them at home.
I would urge all other French fishery owners to be vigilant in this respect too.

I would urge all fishery owners paul, French or not!

Is blame partly not to be put upon the shoulders of the bait companies price and pricing strategies though?

After all, if certain people are going to sell certain flatfish pellets (to name but one) at a tenner a kilo when they are under thirty quid a 25kg sack what do you expect?

'Eyes buys'-is a term used a lot in the retail industry, and if people see pellet and they look similar (and sink!)what happens next..........

Besides, according to a recent poll. Only six percent of people buy their bait on a cost basis!

CA

I can't see your problem really paul,

One thing I like about pellets intended for say sheep feed is the fact that they all have a full and comprehensive ingredient list. You will see instantly if the pellets are suitable. My Ewe Nuts are 60% fish meal, with maize gluten, wheat meal, vitamins and minerals. nothing here tells me that this will cause any harm to the fish whatsoever.

You might say they have never been designed for feeding fish, neither where milk proteins, bird foods, dog buscuits, peperammi, luncheon meat, corn, bread etc etc.

If I buy pellets from a main manufacturer, I pay over the odds, I have no idea what's in them and alot of them are actually re-packaged farm animal feed any way.

I think your main problem is with the notion of 'filling in'
If someone was to fill the place in on a cheap ready made boilie consisting of semolina, ground rice, maize meal, artificial flavourings, artificial sweetner and preservatives would you have a problem with that?

Singy

I don't think you can blame the big bait companies for irresponsible bait use, Olly.
It's like saying Dynamite Baits are responsible for people buying bird nuts.

The big companies are wholesalers and buy from manufacturers adding a margin of profit to cover their costs. Then they sell onto the retailer who then also needs a mark-up to make a profit. The margins aren't massive, mate, believe me and you have to shift an awful lot to make any meaningful money. The baits provided by bait companies are suitable for fish, which is very important.

If someone goes direct to the manufacturer or wholesaler then of course they can save money etc. Or cutting by buying totally unsuitable and potentially dangerous pellet. I saw the dangers and poor results these pellets bring getting on for 20 years ago!

Singy, ask any manufacturer of these pellets and they will tell you in no uncertain terms that they are not suitable for cyprinids. Carp do not possess a stomach mate, and their healthy dietary requirements are entirely different from sheep, pigs, horses etc.

I feed my carp on aquaculture pellets and on the sack it says 'Not suitable for ruminants or farm animals.'

If you have koi, feed them on it extensively and watch what happens. Then go back to the manufacturer with your complaints..

It's irresponsible to promote them, mate.

I saw them first in use by one of Trotters (Famous 5) mates Andy Wilkes on Hawk many moons ago. They were a total fishing disaster...

"Carp do not possess a stomach mate, and their healthy dietary requirements are entirely different from sheep, pigs, horses etc. "

You are right there Paul

But

I've had alot of succes with a ground down dog biscuit as the main base for my boilie. Surely dog food is not suitable for carp, How about vitalin.

Birdfood ingredients? Why do we feed them surely they are made for birds

Why do we feed them milk proteins that are extremely dificult to digest?

Why are the fishmeals I use in my boilies different from the fishmeals in my pellets?

Why are my pellets re-packaged by a bait manufacturer and sold as carp feed? (we use the same supplier)

Can you explain total fishing disaster to me?

Paul, perhaps you could talk to Big Bill and find out if there actually is any difference in Maize Gluten Straights at £4.50 for 25kg and Nutrabaits CSL Pellets at £3 whatever a KG. I think people know how much they have been ripped off in the past and are now prepared to look around and miss out the Bait barrons. It has almost gone full circle back to when there were no bait companies. I totally agree though as I don't think 'Fillin it in' with any food stuff would be good for the fishing. As for the price of Nutrabaits Betain !!!!
Harv

My maize gluten pellets certainly look and smell the same as the Richworth CSL pellets, and I've caught more on them too.

'I don't think you can blame the big bait companies for irresponsible bait use, Olly. ' - er, I did say partly, how many parts is open to debate though!

However, nearly all animal food stuffs come with a reccomended daily dosage per kilo of animal, why not carp pellets? (Education not condemnation!)

I think we are all fairly aware of the margins involed with the logistics of getting items onto the market, but the cost margin on bait is surely their to balance the marketing costs is it not? Besides, economies of scale dictate that they must save even more on their bulk purchases helping to cover their 'wholesalers' costs.

And fair enough, animal feed stuffs aren't aimed at fish, but then again certain caseins are aimed at glue! But if it's in a 'carp' formulated bait it's ok.

If the bait companies were a bit more open and perhaps didn't insult the anglers intelligence for a change, printed sell by dates etc, then perhaps customers would respond to them.

Think I will be sticking with my non-fish ingredient manufacured bait though :-)

CA

Think I am with Singy on this one. I have been using similar pellets on my local and have seen no ill effects, likewise I looked at the content of the pellets and they contain nothing that I have not used as a particle based mix.

Filling in a water is another matter, if said person is putting an "extreme" amount of them in then this can do no good for the water quality. But is this not the same for feeding 25 kilos of bolies over a weekend??????????????

I do understand your concerns about these being "untested" , but isnt this a similar err of caution when high protien baits, dairy feeds etc came on to the carp fishing scene. After all we now understand that boilies arent bad for carp? or are they?????

I would realy like to see any comments from Nutrabaits hand on heart stating that they make, order, are supplied by someone who makes their pellets that DO NOT CONTAIN any ingredients that can not be used for ruminant feeds.

Ps. dont intend on filling in an unamed french water in the next few weeks.