A shame when I see the amount of dead ones on the roads around me that I dont have a captive breeding programme going on in my back shed. Considering they are a protected species its amazing how many people dont seem to bother about having them splattered across the front of their vectras.

But Im rambling....

Has anyone purchased any of the bits and bobs from Badgers, Im looking for a quick bivvy for those roving sessions and dont mind the look of thiers. A hell of a lot cheaper than the Nashy versions..

Feedback appreciated.

[This message has been edited by Paul Selman (edited 12-10-2000).]

Paul.

Soap boxes, You aint heard nothing yet...as they say

I apologise for my reply, because it may just upset the applecart, here before I carry on.

I am really struggling to find the right words....Honestly. No jokes here.

Industry and economy? HA!

Quote "The more prices are forced down....the more the tackle trade suffers, especially the bloke who is trying to earn a living in the local tackle shop....hence, the number of shops going under..."

I can only talk from my personal point of view (dire)

What about the public (me) that struggles to pay the going rate for overpriced goods here in our 'Great Britain' I do not personaly see what is so Great about it, but maybe that is just me.

The blokes that are trying to earn a living, are earning it off my back and many others too. They're not the only industry that is going down then toilet, mine happens to be one too! but who gives a toss?

Surely business is business. And the businesses that survive are those ones that compete. ie quality/cost.

I am the first person, believe it or not, to buy British if I can, but surely businesses must survive on merit and not compassion.

Yes I am skint. Its a fact. Plus I have been involved in a Computer business in the past that failed. Why? Because it could not compete. The reason why is because the owner did not/could not supply the goods/deals that the competitors could.

Please do not flame me for this (passionate) post. As Paul calls; 'Soap Box'

Job...did someone mention job?

Axe.

By the way. The Computer business owner was my own dear Brother.

[This message has been edited by Axeman (edited 13-10-2000).]

Neil

[This message has been edited by Paul Selman (edited 13-10-2000).]

If you read the post carefully I think you will find that I am also suggesting (in the long term) that the industry WILL survive because if the foreign imports ARE poor quality, and cheap, then they 'will not' survive. I may be on the relative poverty line but even I certainly do not see any mileage in buying cheap or foreign.It simply does not pay in the long term.

I was not having a go at anyone or suggesting that anyone is an 'I'm alright Jack' type bloke.

Yes I do kick off a little about cost..etc. This is just a result of a long term poverty type existance and a total distrust of any government.

I will re-iterate though, my point about industry surviving through competetive marketing and quality, not compassion.

Thanks for the wider view Paul. I was not being selfish, I was just being focused.

Can I pick my toupe up now?

Regards Axeman.

[This message has been edited by Peter Sharpe (edited 13-10-2000).]

ps. my fox holdall has a made in china label!!

Ged

It seems like I have let a rather large ***** out of the bag here. And that a number of views about the UK market are being stated.

Why is it that Fox/JRC etc can charge £180 for a bed chair that you can get for £80.

If these are imports then surely why should the UK tackle trade be British. Look around your home. Pioneer, Sony, Sanyo, Hitatchi........Name one UK Manufacuturer that is still British owned.

I am a bit concerened that you cant view the stuff at the shop..

Does anyone know if they have a sale or return policy if you are not happy.

I dont think one has to be 'in the trade' to know that the prices are inflated or even understand the mechanisms of the trade.

Andy may well be more informed than some of us, but do we need to be also?

I suspect we all have been around long enough that even a wild guess or presumption that we are being taken for a ride would be correct here in Britain.

I hope that the manufacturers of Badger (who I hadn't even heard of before this topic) are taking legal advice regarding their 'copys'. Because if their tackle is as good as has been suggested they deserve to take the trade to task.

If anyone here thinks that retail outlets are going to have the lions share of sales in the future, I would put forward that this is not going to be the case. Also if the trade is running scared and worrying about their futures, get on the bandwagon now! and join your competitors and get wired to the net.

If the retailers/ manufacturers think that my statement above is not the way forward, then carry on regardless...of a growing new way/wave of marketing and selling.

Objectively Axeman.

[This message has been edited by Paul Selman (edited 15-10-2000).]

[This message has been edited by Paul Selman (edited 15-10-2000).]

I personaly prefer to discuss, not argue.

I cannot maybe speak so knowledgeably about the trade as someone like yourself and Andy, as no-one sends me any gear to test or would perhaps even value my opinion if they did, because I am just Joe Public.

What I can talk about is the fact that I/we as the Carp anglers are the ones buying all this extensivley, rigourously tested tackle, clothing and luggage. And frankly a lot of it is not up to par. I wish F0x had sent me my bedchair to 'test' instead of making me buy one at £150 and finding out in the middle of a weeks' session that it was poorly constructed. Let alone the hassle I had to go through to get a replacement, after I refused to take advice about how to get the legs to stop sliding down. 'just remove the lever mechanism, and put it in the other way 'round'...I ask you. I did suggest they had a design that worked first instead of a workaround solution. Look at the ongoing problems regarding leaking/poorly designed bivvys for a long term consumer problem. It stinks!

I believe we as customers sometimes end up doing the fieldtesting for the manufacturers, a little like Microsoft keep churning out unfinished, bugridden software. Then asking us to send in reports, then bringing out the latest version befor even perfecting the last one. No one is paying us for this service either.

Developments are one thing and getting it right before release for sale is another

No one here is saying (as I understand) that we want 'cheap over quality' or would really want to see anyone lose their job or work for nothing. But let us at least get the quality that has been built into it through all the fieldtesting that Anglers like yourself do, Paul.

I would too defend my 'occupation/business'if I felt it was under attack also, but I would be also keeping a very keen eye on the consumer trend and feedback, because if the manufacturer/designer/salesman/fieldtester does not, then it may well find that the consumer actually gets fed up of being patronised and ridden roughshod over.

We must have to admit to other facts here. Tackle companys (Badger) etc would not be in the marketplace, if there was No market for them ie. their very existance would not be an issue. But is is an issue. What does that tell me? They have at the moment a percentage share of the market. Why? because someone is buying from them. If their very existance is ignored and ridiculed by the 'larger'companies then at the very least it is arrogant and at the most potentially damaging.

I for one would at least take this as a consumer warning shot across the bows, if I had an investment in the tackle trade.

The F0x alarms you are using at the moment Paul. Was this not a 'getting around patents' excercise? (tell me if I am wrong)

I had an interesting discussion with a few fishing friends this weekend (whilst fishing) And their knowledge of the Badger Company was superior to my own. What I heard was a little disquieting to say the least. Precis; If it is good gear as has been mentioned, then that is great news for us anglers. If it is not, then at least we are not paying for something that is irreplaceable the next season 'round. The trend?

I hate to say this, but we as anglers maybe, just maybe do not share your passion for the Major Manufacturers problems as our main objective is to go fishing with decent gear at a reasonable cost to us. This is what we really want.

I have desperatly been trying to speak objectivly from a 'neutral or consumer' point of view. I am sure I may have failed in some respects, if they are glaring please accept my apologies. And I do not presume to speak from a collective point of view either. Just my own.

Regards Axeman.

Whilst it is the case that Badger does seem to copy other peoples goods, is this any different than what is the general norm for everyday life.

Look at clothing, car manufacturers, electrical goods.

And then look at the price difference from the original product lauch.

I can remember cam corders the size of houses being sold for over a grand. Now you can get em the size of a walkman for under a grand. Innovation killing,,,,,,I think not. Price reducing and effective market leading.....I think so.

Here we are in year 2000 and yes we are in a global economy. I can buy goods in America on the internet far cheaper than in the Uk, what Paul seem sto be advocating is that we should all go out and buy a Rover, or a Bush telly.Dream on its not going to happen.

I dont care where my tackle is made, at the end of the day if its good and does exactly what is says on the tin, and the price is right then I will buy it.

For too long now the major tackle sellers I use this term rather than outright manufacturers as most of the stuff made is sourced from overseas and sold on at a profit, have had a monopoly on the sale of product, Badger has come along and given them a kick up the arse, my guess is that the price will come down.

Clearly the economic argument is there. look at BT, when they were the sole supplier of telephone services etc they charged what they wanted, as soon as competition arrives they have to drop their prices, then when prices are the same the only way to differentiate one company from another is the quality of the service, putting the conumers needs first is the way to keep your business.

Price product and place, yes I've studied marketing and economics as well.

This has been an interesting debate, may well it continue.

Firstly it's my understanding that the majority of manufacturers source a lot of their rods, poles etc. from the Far East - esp. in the low to mid price range - so therefore R&D costs are minimal. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if some of the higher range rods aren't rolled on the same mandrels - the cost of producing a new mandrel is relatively expensive.

As for the quotes of R&D costs being a reason for high prices all I can say is that if it's true then many manufacturers have been throwing their money away!.

Now to price differentials. This is a simple equation; the more stock you buy, the less you pay per item therefore you sell at lower price than your competitor and still make enough profit to survive. Then, in the early nineties, the major manufacturers came along with flat pricing policies on certain lines. This meant that, theoretically, all retailers would be able to sell at a similar price. It didn't work because, despite assurances, it was clear that the big boys still had an advantage. I won't go into reasons as it's not relavant - I'm not sure what I'm saying is either. The only manufacturer who had/has a true flat price policy is Peter Drennan - you will not see his tackle discounted or 'dumped' through the trade.

So the moral is; if your local tackle shop competes on service use it because you don't know what you've got till it's gone. I must go and get my guitar out I'm sure I can make something of that last line. Got rambling on my mind now.

Silure aka Robert Johnson.

quote:

---

Originally posted by stealth:
I ordered Badger and Fox ,when I got the fox it must have been in the post a long time as it was all smelly and the fur was matted as well ,it must have been killed some time ago .The Badger on the other hand was fresh and the fur was smooth and warm ,was in good condition ,and it had all it's teeth ,a real prime example of a British animal ,it cost less too.....Stealth....

---

Let us then hope that these retailers are doing their job then, and actually advising (younger) customers of the choices avaliable to them at a cheaper cost. Or is the retailer markup greater on Fox or Daiwa etc.

It is hardly justification for over inflated prices, it smacks a little of exploitation to me...but is this not what we have become to know in most areas of retail as 'rip-off Britain'

Dont get me wrong, if I worked in the fishing/tackle trade I am sure I would still believe what I do now. But it would not stop me doing what I had to do. It might just stop me saying it...!

I'll have a bet with you Paul. If Badger are still around in 12 months, you give me £100
If they are not, I will give you what my Fox Voyager bedchair is worth.

Axe.

Prime examples. Mix your own goddamn seeds

Axe.

Hey Noddy, I earn a (pathetic) living from street cred(it) so dont knock it

Got the OK from the Missus.

Now that we have the sproglett there are other things to consider.

Im going to place an order for the sleeping bag that they are offering for 35 quid. I have been using my old army 58 pattern now for the last 3 years and its looking a bit rough.

If its ok Paul could I post a review of it on the site.

When you have seen that the price of a 9 foot fly rod, with wire rings, can hit £500 quid, think how much 3 of those would set you back.

But it does make you think

Even us working class have standards to keep. I wouldn't sell my shell suit to save my life

Axe.

It just shows people like to read your stuff you warehouse members - you are all stars!

[This message has been edited by Kevin Babij (edited 18-10-2000).]

[This message has been edited by Kevin Babij (edited 18-10-2000).]

Check this out for quick. It should be here by lunch tomorrow. And Im off for a session on the weekend, so Ill write my review on the bank and bang it to you via your mail so that you can read through it.

I have also ordered some of their pozi lock converters and some hair stops, I was tempted to go for loads of other bits too. But I want some cigars for xmas and the missus would have killed me.

I didnt think that this post would come sooooooo active, must be a record.

Some clever b@stard wrote "The F0x alarms you are using at the moment Paul. Was this not a 'getting around patents' excercise? (tell me if I am wrong)"

Del Romang, considering what has been said, (on paper), should have been able to sue the arse of Bamford. Did he?

Or if he did, did he succeed? Did he 'eckers like. Hence all the new 'versions' of his alarm over at least 18 years.

So on paper, innovation and design is a fine concept to aspire to. So hold up your hands all you new, keen, innovative designers who have not ripped off that particular concept/design.

And also those who are not using a derivation of the original optonics/roller wheel.

Axe.

Few and far between, I would guess.

[This message has been edited by Paul Selman (edited 18-10-2000).]

Nothing wrong with being corrected in my book.
I was only playing Devils Advocate...Only Joking, I was using that as a cop out for a laugh.

I will just say that I have been away for a long time as I have openly admitted and my facts(!) maybe a little blurred.

Either way you look at it the Optonics of '82 have somehow been converted (excuse the pun) to the Fox's of today. May be just by simple and 'obviously excuseable loopholes' in the law.

Let us not kid ourselves here, The roller system has been copied, by whatever legal/illegal means and are still prevalent in the major sales of buzzers today.

Hence, innovative design, originality etc, is not prevalent even 18-20 years after the original system became saleable.

I put facts on the line when I post, but I do not put the truth of reality out to dry.

Axe.

[This message has been edited by Axeman (edited 19-10-2000).]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Paul Selman:
Errrr, sorry to correct you Axe (you've been away too long!) but my good friend Les Bamford (and occasional employer) was threatened with court action by Fat Frank...hence he stopped trading in converted Optonics. Also my good friend Del Romang was also taken to court by Fat Frank.....and changed his design etc.....
The Fox buzzers I use (DXR's) do not infringe any patent held anywhere whatsover.

[This message has been edited by Paul Selman (edited 18-10-2000).]

---

Excuse me if I sound a bit lost here but why was it fat Frank who threatened the court action ? Or did I miss something along the way whilst fishing.

------------------
Chris S

[This message has been edited by Kevin Babij (edited 19-10-2000).]

They aint here.

Aparent computer problem with their email ordering. Wont be dispatched untill tomorrow, gonna be monday, Even the mention that I was going to be doing a review didnt get em posted out today.

Not looking good so far, but Ill allow em one mistake...P.s what did the other gear look like??

Axe.

[This message has been edited by Axeman (edited 20-10-2000).]

However, after doing a bit of (sorry for the pun) BADGERING Ive got em sent off by 24 hour weekend delivery at £25 cost, met half by me and half by them. Should be here tomorrow.

Latest news, the guy is getting a bit stressed, he is dispatching around 100 orders a day, with even more coming in. He has purchased a new factory unit and is expanding. More products coming including BOATS.....I had a good enough chat with him, and he is posting the stuff off so that I can get it reviewed for this weekend. Keep your eyes this way...

[This message has been edited by the1englishman (edited 21-10-2000).]

BTW the Badger rods are exactly the smae blanks as the rods sold by Waterline of Sheffield as the Majestic (own brand which they sell to the trade at a higher price than Badger sell to the public!!!!!!!!). If Badger sold the Decennium or Image (Waterline own brands) then some of the major rod companies may want to take a second look as these rods are superb for the money! Yes even better value than F** Rangemasters!!!!! These come with TRUE SIC's starting at less than £70 each!!!!!!

Sorry if I went on a bit. Just leting you guys know my findings.

------------------
Darren Wilson

quote:

---

Originally posted by Lancs Lad:
Well. put me down on your list......thats 99 to go...

---

If you are remotely serious, I'll have one...

Like someone else posted earlier in this thread, you pays your money and you get what u pays in the end. I have been informed that Solar's aftersales service is first class, which I don't mind paying a bit extra for the itmes just ot be safe.

------------------
Darren Wilson

quote:

---

Originally posted by BivvyUp@TCL:
Sorry chaps, I won't be selling these as I do respect the work that Solar have put into their products ( and I do not want any unnesseccary legal proceedings taken against me). I placed the post as an example to how much the actual items cost to make, not to actually sell them. I don't know if Solar actually make these items in house or they are made elsewhere. Unlike Solar I don't havre staff to pay to work for me otherwise the items (if I was selling them) would be higher to incorporate these outgoings.

Like someone else posted earlier in this thread, you pays your money and you get what u pays in the end. I have been informed that Solar's aftersales service is first class, which I don't mind paying a bit extra for the itmes just ot be safe.

---

Ahhhh spoil sport !!! Understoon, I was just trying me luck !

quote:

---

Originally posted by Lancs Lad:
Well. put me down on your list......thats 99 to go...

---

Just havin a laugh...Now wheres that template for the outer cover of my all new micropussy....

Euro unhooking mat
chair
large bivvy table
50 PVA bags

and got some change from a 100 quid which isn't bad.

The unhooking mat is the absolute dogs, too large for a normal trip but just what you want for large french carp which don't seem to stop fighting once you've netted them. I think this is probably a copy of a pelzer design, has an edge a bit like a dingy and is filled with poly balls, its absolutely huge and we used it on a trip to france a couple of weeks a go and it was top superb. Manufacturing quality is as good as any of the top name manufacturers.

The chair also looks fine and has been used for a while. It replaced one of the original fox chairs I have been using since the 80s, the canvas finally ripped. I'll be surprised if this one lasts as long since the leg adjusting pegs look a bit iffy but I've no complaints so far.

Bivy table is a copy of the fox one, perfectly O.K. at a third of the price, I mean 30 notes for a little metal table is taking the p*** isn't it!

PVA bags are similar to other cheap ones I've bought, O.K. but a bit thin for licking and sticking.

I thought it was an excellent deal and I'll be getting more of their stuff. Unhooking mat it reccomended to all, I'd like to know if anyone has tried their bivvy's ?

The tackle trade has been ripping people people off for a long time, particularly bite alarms in my opinion which are not exactly complicated and must cost a couple of quid to manufacture in bulk. I bought some new fox alarms last year, then realised that the switches would get switched on in my bag and had to buy 3 covers (bits of moulded plastic) a 5 quid each!

quote:

---

Originally posted by Alan Roe:
Lancs Lad and others who have bought from this firm how was the stuff you bought? any good?

---

Hi Alan, I have purchased the bag and a review of the item is in the REVIEWS section. Have a read through. I am impressed.

Cost £11.00 +VAT - sell £20.00 inc VAT. Remove the VAT from the sale to leave approx. £17.00. Total profit £6.00. No wonder you don't see many rich tackle shop owners. This equates to a standard 50% mark up.

Receive a 10% discount and you've just knocked 30% off the owners wages at the end of the week!.

Are you really Stephen Hawkins in disguise?

Axe.

[This message has been edited by Axeman (edited 13-11-2000).]

PS. Any chance of including a spell checker on the site?.

[This message has been edited by Silure (edited 14-11-2000).]

Orignal Supplier price X2 + Vat.

i.e o.s.p @ £15 = RRp @ £30
(original supplier price) (osp x2)
+ Vat @17.5% added to the RRp.

Meaning in my book a mark up of 100%. As you have made the same profit and are not going to lose out on anything for V.A.T.

(exterminate, exterminate, exterminate)

Serious question here. You wern't in the Falklands or had tours in Ireland did you?

Axe.

What guitar(s) do you play, blues styIe I guess. By the way, what is an Arboriculturist?

Axe.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Axeman:
Lancs.

Serious question here. You wern't in the Falklands or had tours in Ireland did you?

Axe.

---

Was still in short trousers when the falklands came around.

Thankfuly didnt go to Ireland.....Dirty war...

Just missed out on the gulf.......Think I was in when they feeded em, not needed em..(as the saying goes).

Arboriculturist - fancy name for Tree Surgeon so I must be an axe man. In my dreams I stumble round the Delta with acoustic guitar.

Perfect description of 100% mark up. Standard mark up in the tackle trade is 50% with a few exceptions i.e. hooks, swivels, floats, boilies etc.

In my dreams I pose on stage with Joe Satriani and Steve Vai... But I have heard, their dreams are to give it some with the Axeman... Thier loss.

Axe.

If I'm ever at the Crossroads I'll sell my soul to the devil.

Roger that I did it years ago.

Ibanez Jem 777 and Jackson Soloist Snakeskin rool!!

Axe.

p.s. I used to think that Robert Fripp was God when I was younger, but after hearing Al Dimeola, (I guessed at the spelling), on the radio one night in the summer, he made him sound like a raw beginner..

Back to Badger, I just bought there heavy duty stainless pod (not the big wheeler).
Very, very good pod, 3 rod adjustable buzzers and 3 stainless rear rests, all for £40...........
Certainly better than £140......

Yngwie J Malmsteen is also a genius, although to me his classical riffs are a little too repetitive, and can get boring after a while.

Oh yeah, badger...whatever.

Axe.

To be honest, I dont think that you can beat a good akai sampler, a drum machine, a Korg, oral exciter and Qbase.....

But, Im just a modern boy, from a modern world.........

Didnt hendrix get burnt to death from one of his guitars seeking revenge.....

Cubase sucks (too unstable). Cakewalk is the way to go. With a Fostex digital 8-track and an Alesis DM5 drum machine with a Yamaha FX 500 digital signal processor linked through a Zoom 8080 guitar signal processor pedal board. You cant go wrong. Did I say that Cubase sucks?

Axe.

Hendrix got burnt to death by his drug habit seeking revenge. He was out of his head when he played, thats why he was a hero. Try doing it sober. Its a new ballgame.

[This message has been edited by Axeman (edited 15-11-2000).]

How about a nice bit of 'House' or maybe 'Garage'

I tend to go for a block of flats and a small garden shed myself........

Sorry just being silly..............carry on...

------------------
All the Best
Andy

Gary Moore, is also the essence of 'heart' playing.

Axe.

Axe.

Kirk Hammitt: good, fretwanks a bit. I actually prefer James Hetfeild; I find that he underpins Hammitts riffs quite impressively.

I'm not a big 'flash' guitarist fan: I'd rather listen to someone playing with passion and a good melody than purely showing off. I 'd pick Cobain or Reznor (one of the last great multi-talented musicians we have).

On a more modern note, I like: Andy Cairns from Therapy? - he may not be the most technically gifted guitarist ever, but he has a good ear for a strong tune, and he has something a lot of modern guitarists also lack - a distinctive sound and playing style.

Josh Homme from Queens of the Stone Age (and previously Kyuss) also has this: he can shifter gears at a level I don't think has been seen since Metallica's classic period. Check out 'Better Living Through Chemistry' on the Queens new album 'Rated R' - 2 classic riffs fused magically. And 'Feel Good Hit of the Summer', from the same album, has the most fantastic chaotic solo post-Hendrix.

I also rate Radiohead's three guitarists: Thom Yorkes gentle strum, Ed O'Brian's ability to create such soft yet strangely edgey riffs, and Jonny Greenwoods screaming thrash-outs; skill with melody.

Gear wise, I can't see the big deal about Les Pauls: I find their sound a little too one-dimensional (warm tone, and thats it). I prefer, and use mostly, strats - classic and versatile. Tele's are a bit too whiney; as are jags (which feed back like hell at the best of times). I'm hoping to get an SG soon, preferably converted so that it has a single-coil pick up in between the two humbuckers, giving an improved tonal range. A Floyd Rose Trem arm would be nice too.....

That just about covers it. Now can we get back to talking about fishing.

mutt

------------------
staffs bait services
THE DUCKS NUTS

I love the original sound of the Telecaster, plus it was the first original guitar I ever played. I had a Les Paul copy once, but it was fitted with a Di'marzio and it was superb, even if it was only made out of plank. I dislike the Strat, as I agree it is too weak and does not suit my playing anyway.

Axe

quote:

---

Originally posted by Axeman:
Lancs.

Cubase sucks (too unstable). Cakewalk is the way to go. With a Fostex digital 8-track and an Alesis DM5 drum machine with a Yamaha FX 500 digital signal processor linked through a Zoom 8080 guitar signal processor pedal board. You cant go wrong. Did I say that Cubase sucks?

Axe.

Hendrix got burnt to death by his drug habit seeking revenge. He was out of his head when he played, thats why he was a hero. Try doing it sober. Its a new ballgame.

[This message has been edited by Axeman (edited 15-11-2000).]

---

Playing.....I had enough problems trying to dance...Left the playing to my mate......The troubles of a misspent youth...

But then again,,,,,rock and rolling it in a travel lodge in glasgow was fun......

The one with strobe light, lazer, and women podium dancers.

Strats sound way to tinny for me. I prefer the crunch you get out of a BC Rich or Ibanez. My brother has a great BC Rich Warlock that has a sound that'll rip your face off!!!!!!

Cheers Pete.

Think a black one with a white stripe would be better.

I have it that he is expanding.....

Quote:

---

Lancs Lad and others who have bought from this firm how was the stuff you bought? any good?

---

bought a rucksack fell apart v quickly never again

Quote:

---

Anyone fancy a little bet?
I bet Badger are no longer with us within 12 months or less!
Their advertising budget must be colossal - full regular colour pages in AT/AM which don't come cheap, and multiple spreads in all the magazines...
One other point which hasn't been mentioned above. I've said it before but posters on this site are not typical purchasers of tackle and kit. More typical purchasers tend to be younger (cough!) and just taking up carp fishing. My friends in the trade tell me they tend to go for fashionable names such as Fox and Daiwa, even though the kit may be more expensive than similar kit at a lower price.
Where's the street-cred in using Badger gear for newcomers who it matters to?

---

Wish I took that bet up
Keith

Quote:

---

When Des Taylor was involved with Badger (hereafter referred to as Bodger!) I made enquiries about whether the company would be interested in taking on-line orders from FW....

Des was honest enough to say that many of the items advertised in the mags were not actually in stock....and only came into stock when sufficient orders were received for them to be paid for up front and then manufactured in China and then shipped out...

Therefore this was no good to us, as FW members rightly expected prompt delivery of goods after payment....not no delivery ever if there were not sufficent orders...

Bodger sums them up......

---

This is the guy that has the 'Cheek' to moan about instant bait companies setting up with a 100 kilo's of CSL pellet in their dispose and actually calling themselves 'Bait companies', what's up Des? They taking away your profit with good 'nutritional' products? , you might write for Carpworld on the occasion, but from what i have seen and heard about SBS gear sums it up, total sh*te in my opinion . Carry on m8, give us all a laugh