Following a meeting with Bill Ward at the last NEC show in 2006, I agreed to not criticise the Carp Society anymore on FW for it's betrayal of the founding members aims, like myself....

My previously lifetime honorary membership (which costs the CS nowt) has not been restored since, which I thought would be a half-decent gesture on their part...

So, gloves off, check out the abortion which is now the official Carp Society site at http://www.thecarpsociety.com

Stinker...

Looks like someone did it for their GCSE project

very poor

The joke myth is still being perpetuated also on this Mickey Mouse site that the CS has some control over Redmire Pool...

This is totally UNTRUE....

Still, an ex-RMC big wig I'm sure is going to be announced very soon on this site as a new highly-paid CS employee... ..despite only a five minute involvement....

I'm sure Saul could have knocked up a better site in he's dinner hour... as for the 'Society' it is as i have previously stated..'A Dying Dinosaur'.

Is it not time for a new wave of movement that stands for us 'All'??

At least I can fcukin read it!

Paul, I know nothing about your battle against the Carp Society and to be really truthful it is none of my business.

I never was one for the echelons of power craving that existed at that time and many of the fall outs at the time were created through those very power cravings and bloody dummy spitting.

What I can say though is that David Mannal has gone out of his way to help me enjoy my angling on horseshoe. He works his butt off trying to make the lake a better place for Anglers, no job is beneath him to do and at no time has he appeared a power crazy individual, quite the contrary in fact.

In fact since starting carp fishing in 1973/74 I don't think I have ever fished such an enjoyable lake run in such a professional manner.

You naturally have your feud with the Society and that is one that you should deal personally either through litigation or other means, but by publishing such comments will put other people off from fishing such a fantastic place which is run very professionally.

Personally I think that the organisation "The Carp Society" should be changed to something encompassing it current trading.

As for it's web site, does it really matter, I was in the computer game for nearly 20 years and the most hit sites are ones that load quickly without a load of Java, or Flash or Graphics and present their idea simply and without complication.

It might not be all singing or dancing, but it does the job.

Lets get back to talking about fishing, there is enough politics and crap about, lets just get on with enjoying our fishing.

I'm not trying to decry your position Paul, if & when we are on the bank side you want to chew the fat over a cuppa, then I am all ears, but lets stop all this crap and politics there is enough shite in the world without keep fueling the same old stories.

The Society more or less scrapped Carp Fisher to provide members with a quality website, it said... ...that's the point I'm trying to make...if this is IT it's yet another rip-off for Carp Society people paying expensive subs who don't fish Horseshoe or any of their other waters....

Your website experience is dated, John, people expect a bit of quality nowadays.....

I totally agree with you Paul on all of your points. I left the carp society long ago because I felt that it had already lost its way and the only way it could change its name to something that resembles its current standing is to call itself "Horseshoe fishing club." At one stage it had the UK at its finger tips and now it hardly exists.

The toys have definately left the pram.......hilarious.

Not really Spider. It doesn't affect me anymore because I live in France, I just feel that it is a massive shame and a massive loss of an opportunity for all you carp anglers still in England.

I too agree with Moorsey. The CS has basically let down it's membership over the last few years or more. I too resigned my membership in disgust when they withdrew support from the SAA. I rejoined so as to attend the AGM (they refused to let people like Paul). They had an expensive solicitor there to fight their corner (and blamed the members for having to do so). They did subsequently u-turn over the SAA issue but their manner and ethos was so up themselves that they really didn't care what the members wanted and still don't appear to.

Simply put if it weren't for horseshoe the CS would probably have long since been dead and buried (IMHO ).

Rob.

Getting back to the subject of the thread...............

Looks to me like the CS have lost the hosting from previous ISP as this site comes from BT.......

Wonder if they have overspent on 'other' projects & have had to cut back a bit

I think the overspend may well be on salaries???????

Looking at the accounts they borrowed heavily to pay for the clubhouse....

Got to agree about the website very poor !
Also not sure about the new logo ?

Take cover ! dummies at 2 o'clock

Cheers
Saul

I'm in a bit of a tricky position here because I quite fancy having a go on Horseshoe, which by most accounts can offer some spectacular fishing if you catch it right....

But...I checked out the Website (Which is truly awful) and came across the 'Development Plan for Horseshoe'. Have a read, it left me feeling totally and utterly cold....who on earth wrote this crap?












Reproduced from the Carp Society Website [Accessed March 2007]

How absolutely fecking awful......

municipal park carp fishing - madness

Sorry Paul, but don't agree, you are letting your own personal bitterness enter into this forum, how the Society is run is for members to vote with their pockets, non members have no place in criticising.

As for Web Experience Paul, I have written and still write and maintain a number of web sites, how many have you written?, in fact how many computer companies have you owned, I see web sites from a different place Paul, one involving bandwidth, hits and download times, the simplest sites are the most frequently visited...fact. Their new site is functional for a contact basis, if that is all they plan, it can easily be expanded and developed upon.

We have both been around the carp scene a similar time Paul, we have seen the power struggles and in house feuding, isn't it time we let it go.

If I have a problem with someone I take it up personally with them until it is finally resolved, either by litigation or through discussion, why don't you try talking to David on a one to one basis?

No offence meant to you, just an observation.

I think, with respect, it's you who's got the wrong end of the stick. Paul has more than a little bit of history with the CS and just like every one else, is entitled his view - just as you are. People did vote with their pockets and a lot of us left. A number of us wrote explaining the reasoning but got no reply. So we all have the right to comment. And anyway as long as the CS website is a public website open to everybody to look at, it is open to criticism and comment by the whole world.

Back on topic again, the site is a joke.

Rob.

I am sorry John but like Rob above I am in agreement with Paul.

Not that you can tell, but the Carp Society is meant to be a national Carp organisation that is run in a democratic manner putting the interest of its members, carp and carp anglers first. The Carp Society is not Horseshoe Lake. Horseshoe Lake was meant to help secure the future of the Carp Society not become the future.

Under the current committee as a national carp organisation the Carp Society has ceased to exist. It is a pointless exercise members voting with their pockets because by their actions the committee have made it clear that they are not interested in the members or the Carp Society as an ideal. In fact I think it would suit them down to the ground if every member left and they could burry the Carp Society for good. What they wanted and what they got was Horseshoe Lake.

Of course Horseshoe Lake is a wonderful place of course David Mannal is falling over himself to help.

If I did a little bit of ducking diving that effectively lead to me acquiring Horseshoe Lake for free I would also be walking round looking like the cat that got the cream.

Horseshoe Lake is not a barometer as to the health of the Carp Society John, in fact currently it is quite the opposite. All the recent efforts and finance that have gone into Horseshoe have been to the detriment of the society as a whole.

If you don't believe that re-read your first post it spells it out for all to see. You have labeled judged and now defend the Carp Society by Horseshoe alone.

As for the web site, yes it may do the job and be functional however, I think you are missing the point. Carp Fisher was one of the very few benefits of being a Carp Society member. This was a tangible return members saw for their membership fee. Upon scrapping Carp Fisher they did not say we are going to continue taking your money and give you nothing in return, a quality web site was implied as replacement.

Just remember when you are enjoying Horseshoe and all it offers that the current regime have added very little to the experience, they simply waltzed in and took control of what was almost the finished article. Ask yourself why many if not most of the people who truly made Horseshoe what it is today are strongly opposed to the current regime. People like Paul who was involved with securing Horseshoe for the society in the first place.

Also try and find out what happened when a group of unhappy members were planning to exercise their democratic right to be voted onto the committee and membership renewals mysteriously disappeared.

No wonder David Mannal is happy to help out with a smile.

Hi Rob & Andy,

Thanks for your replies, I do not wish to get into an argument with either of you as you both have your views and opinions.

I have many personal recollections at the inception of the Carp Society and the reasons for it's formation (Peter Mohan and the CAA & BCSG spring to mind as one of the things).

Unfortunately I also have many other recollections at the time of which I would rather not discuss.

Indeed I do agree that the Carp Society has changed and thus my comment: -



I have stated my opinions and my thoughts on David Mannall which remain unchanged, however out of respect I will not comment further on this thread.

I think it's just a shame the way the carp society has turned out , there was a time when it was the forerunner and leader in all that is good about carping with the emphasis being on the angling and carp welfare but since the whole carp scene has evolved into a big money spinner with morals and principles being replaced with greed and selfishness . Carp society meetings were the highlight of the calender be it local or the big annual ones , to write for carp fisher was considered to be a privalage and an honour to which i was fortunate enough to write for a few without even a thought given to getting paid for it .
I guess we all have our opinions as to who when and where it all changed i just miss the comerardery and fun we all used to have .

Never guess who that's gonna be then?

Has anyone in the Carp Society 'Directors' (sic) team got the balls and concern for current and potential CS members to comment on this very poor website......?

My criticism of the website revolves more around the content; and I’ll admit to knowing very little about the carp society.

I copied and pasted these objectives from a section entitled ‘brief history’

1. To entertain members through publications and meetings.
2. To take some of the competitiveness out of carp fishing and influence carp anglers to adopt a moderate attitude and fish for pleasure rather than prestige.
3. To make an effort to protect carp fishing, and angling generally, through a collective involvement in angling politics.


Reading through the site I was unable to ascertain if these are the current aims of the society and, more importantly how they intend to achieve these aims.


Come on Carp Society, I would be more than happy to donate money to a good cause! Why not use the website to celebrate any past achievements you have had and tell me how you intend to spend my money on making thing better for us all.

The content of the site left me under the impression ‘The Carp Society’ is a fisheries business with a bit of history.

"Carp Society people paying expensive subs who don't fish Horseshoe "

Is there such a person Paul?... the carp society is an angling club, no more, no less.... anyone joining apart from members of the lakes in question is just plain stupid...

point is,

other clubs are falling to the same fate...................

what worse is the media does not do its job and make these people suffer....

Guys you have several options

It is undoubtedly one of the best waters with some of the best looking carp in the country.

It is available to all - this doesnt suit everyone.

If you dont like it - dont fish there.

If you dont like the web site - come on here and hijack threads.

YAWNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN

Oh dear....they aint sent you a membership card this year....oh my...so you go back to being a wally and slagging them off again....Your sooooooooooooooo boring Paul.

Beige and cream forum....very nice....very 50's

So tell me Carpynick, what have you ever done for the Carp Society or carp fishing in general?

Plenty Paul...what has that got to do with you and this thread i dont know...but i certainly aint going to get in an argument with you....its not worth it...get some fresh grapes fella!!

And what in gods name is that mutant your holding in your profile picture

So you're a Director then....or organising kids fish-ins...?

Do tell...

The Mutant is a Horton carp, which is a considerably harder beast to catch than any Horseshoe carp, which are not Leney's as advertised by the way....

Tell me, Carpnick would you put your house and all your income at risk to save the current Carp Society and Horseshoe Lake from being made bankrupt by its bankers...?

I doubt it, son...

That's what I did, so before you start having a pop think about that. NONE of the current Directors did that, and are just reaping the benefits of what other people did - were prepared to do that ....

No no no...not a director Paul...i like to get outside and do things,not sit on my arris infront of a PC slagging of an organisation....listening to suck ups saying it will fold etc...i got news for you,the Society is here to stay..now funds have stopped disapearing amongst other things when there were too many bigshots involved....come on Paul,Horseshoe is there number one asset...so why shouldnt they revolve the society round the beautiful place.

I have never joined echo...no one gets a magazine or a chance to fish 3 lakes...but i dont come on the internet and mock them ;o)

We've crossed over posts...so I'm asking again would you put everything you have and own to keep the Society and Horseshoe afloat...

I and five others did that...would you?

You also were not an original Horseshoe permit holder (I have the list here)...

Sitting on my arse...ask Mannall and Ward about the SAA you plonker... and three years voluntary General Secretary when we had 4,000-5,000 members, not the tiny rump now...

I think we may need a referee for this one chaps? Now, you see,this is turning into something worth reading!!!!!!

No i wouldnt Paul,and dont get me wrong,you have done plenty for the Society in the past...but i dont want to get into an argument over history...its just the way you posted about them on here for the last few years.It makes you look bitter,why should they send you a free card.

Thats all im saying on this thread.....

PS,when i asked about the mutant,i was actually talking to the fish(joke)

Interesting.

"For those of you who intend to book a session on Redmire I would very much like to hear from you (perhaps even an article for the magazine)"

What "magazine" would that be then?

you can also fish horseshoe for free because they ain't had a baliff for about 3 months

why have you fished it for free

nope i paid for a season ticket but seen plenty who have

Too busy, perhaps, selling fishing gear and bacon sarnies out of the 'Centre of Excellence'....

Farlows comes to mind, not a 'national' carp organisation...

Is the CS a Ltd company or a charity? Who actually owns the assets, and what would happen to the monies raised in the event of collapse?

It's not going to go bust....

However, it does need to be constantly reminded of its original aims as set out in it's About Us on the website and in it's own current Memorandum of Association.....

As Andy Jack said above Horseshoe was designed to be the making of the Carp Society as a national organisation, not the end of it...

Have to agree with Paul on this point..!
Yes there is contact and venue info on their new site, but if the comment above is correct and the site is intended to be some kind of quality replacement then it's a pee poor one.

It's not the CS anymore, it's a club and there are far better ones available.

Come on paul time to got off your high horse.You know aswell as many others do what happened to alot of the funds when you & others had input to the cs,I have seen the books or lack of them.
If you have an axe to grid take it up with the powers that be at the cs & not get your arse lickers who know jack shit about the past mouthing off.

Re-name it the Horseshoe Angling Club and then no-one will have any gripes... to continue with the name Carp Society reflects on the days when it was important...

Yawn yawn ... what a load b@ollock this thread is...

Carp Society was something when i was a kid .. Germany.. remember Paul.. warrington.. you sent me there in your draw to represent the north west when i was 15 ...

Didnt tell you i was top rod did i ..? Only Andy Little caught more.. (or did he)

Times change.. wouldnt have have anything to do with it now.. all lost its way .. BSCG .. etc etc ... fish without prejudice.. and have a red along the way ..

never heard of it

now the Captains in it shows it's all going downhill

Now the captains it shows its going down hill,what the f**k you on about.It seems you are all jumping on the band wagon to fight Pauls battle knowing little about pauls & others little back pocket deals.The reason the cs struggled for a few years was because of the mess it was left in when certain people jump ship.

get a kin life fella it was all tounge and cheek
for jesus sake go bck to your Goldfish bowl

Not tounge & cheek from Pauls side,time he let go of the past & got a life himself.Life to sort to hold a grudge as long as he has,shame hes got f**k all else to fill his spare time instead of slagging off cs.Those running it know are only rebuilding what others have f**ked up in the past.

captain who ?

just thought i'll stir a bit but havin JDB is like havin the beakerman

In the Mix, you know jack-[censored] about the Carp Society and keep posting your libel on here and I'll see you in court...

The Carp Society has kept audited accounts since it's existence, and these were published IN DEPTH year on year in its publications (remember those), unlike the scant general accounts posted today which the members can make no sense of... The accounts were also put on every chair when the CS had proper conferences which started with the AGM when hundreds attended...unlike the barely quorate meetings held today on Tuesday nights in Swindon...

No one was on the take....we did what we did on agreed terms but ALSO FOR LOVE of a genuine national carp organisation, of which I was a founder member...

I don't have a life do I, and I'm a sad [censored] am I? Well, let's compare your life to mine, shall we....

I have a professional job teaching law, in which I am well-respected and well paid.

I own six carp lakes which are more or less fully booked each year

I'm the Editor of the busiest fishing site in Europe - the FW

I'm sponsored by giants Daiwa and Nutrabaits.

I live in a large house in Cheshire, and have a supportive wife and family.

I fish some of the top carp lakes in the UK

Sad [censored], moi?

Now tell us, about you, Mr Anonymous...

I don't have a life do I, and I'm a sad [censored] am I? Well, let's compare your life to mine, shall we....;\)

I have a professional job teaching law, in which I am well-respected and well paid. ;\)

I own six carp lakes which are more or less fully booked each year;\)

I'm the Editor of the busiest fishing site in Europe - the FW ;\)

I'm sponsored by giants Daiwa and Nutrabaits. ;\)

I live in a large house in Cheshire, and have a supportive wife and family. ;\)

I fish some of the top carp lakes in the UK ;\)

Jesus Paul now we all know how sad you are !

Harv

You missed out short, fat bastad

PMSFLMAOL

Daz, I'm 5'10" (hardly short!) and 13 stone at the moment...

pmsl

That makes you short and fat Paul

Im 6ft2" and 11st6lb mate...joke before you bite my head off n'all

In Joes defence (I know him,I think he can be a t1t of the highest order at times and i'd say it to his face) Joe's membership of the group may be a shocker to many (me included :o)BUT to be fair membership of the group is not all about what many think and Joes commitment to helping youngsters in the NW IS SECOND TO NONE his personal doings are what amaze me when it comes to his acceptance to the group BUT thats what the group is all about.it's supposed to be about putting something back into the sport as well as many other things.You want to take a look at the list of members and you will see what I mean

Their not modern day magazine wannabes the vast majority are unsung heros of carp fishing...

John (cough) JDB's admission into the BCSG has nothing to do with this thread......which is about the declining Carp Society....

You've got to be on something...

I know Joes group thing has nothing to do with this thread,BUT if you read back a page or so somebody was trying to play devil's advocate and imply that I had gained group status mate

Hence my post Paul

Im on something alright,it's called tea cooking,washing clothes and e-baying my life away to raise funds to fix the roof...you would know nothing of my poverty for you are rich mate

ps...your still short and fat

The truth is out there,time will catch up.

Moulder and Scully are on the case now

truth is .... its only carp fishing,
Bit ott on the capital wealth there Paul... you may well be the richest guy on this website BUT it certainly seems like you still have a serious chip on your shoulder!!

Before you ask what I've done for carp fishing, I'll tell you .
I fished for carp ! Never sought recognition, never looked to make money out pf all the mugs who believed all they read, just fished for carp.

The chip on your shoulder is obviously bigger....

Plus, I suspect Pete B has got more money than me...

[quote=IN THE MIX]Come on paul time to got off your high horse.You know aswell as many others do what happened to alot of the funds when you & others had input to the cs,I have seen the books or lack of them.

So where are the funds going now. When was the last time the Carp Society published a detailed Balance Sheet at the AGM, I can't remember one in the last nine years of membership. All that is published now is a breakdown of the Balance Sheet. Why,because they don't want the membership to know whats being taken out in wages and expenses. I have it on good authority that Dave Mannall was once heard to comment he would not work for less than £100 a day. That means he is being paid £36,500.00. The new manager, I believe his name is Luke must be on about £15,000 at the very least. David's wife must be on £10 to £15 an hour for part time work? Who knows if the Directors are paid? It is known the baliffs and helpers work for free which is a disgrace. Being generous they must be taking £51,500 out in wages and expenses at least. Why the hell do they need two managers.
With regards to whats coming in, the Carp Show must be a gold mine. The trade pay to have stands at huge figures and then they charge the public to pay to buy tackle etc. All the helpers work for free, so its a nice little earner. The Junior Carp Camp lads are being charged £120. If they get 40 which is a rough estimate, thats another £4800. Being generous again,lets say £500 for food, thats another £4,300 profit, thank you very much. The Pike and Tench Fish-ins must have made the same. Next season the full ticket is going up to £450 (at the AGM they said it would remain at £425). If they get 60 takers, thats £27,000 straight away. Say double that for day and 24 hour tickets, thats another £54,000. There is also money coming in for breakfast, bait and the tackle shop. There is also the money they make from their other two fisheries. How many members do they have, who knows? If its 5000, at £30.00, thats £150,000. What do you get, a poxy web site with old articles from the Carpfisher. Quess what, no forum, as if they dare. Its no wonder they can afford a new lodge costing £400,000 with the most expensive plasma television you can buy. Centre of Excellence in what? making money!
You can now see why they don't issue a detailed Balance Sheet. The Carp Society is now a commercial business that no longer represents Carp anglers and never will unless we the members change it. How. Put forward our own representives for Directors, vote the old directors out (WHEN THEY COME UP FOR RENEWAL) and ours in at the AGM. Thats if they don't change the rules for electing Directors in the mean time. There's only one problem, many have lot to say, but to get them at a AGM to try and bring the Carp Society back under the members control is another thing.

dodger&diver,did you even bother going to agm? if not how do you plan on making your point?

"Plus, I suspect Pete B has got more money than me..."

Compared to you Paul, I am but a pauper scavenging tit bits from the masters table...

Stunning post dodger&diver.

kind regards Jeff

dodger&diver,did you even bother going to agm? if not how do you plan on making your point?

Unfortunately I was in hospital at the time, as much as I wanted to be there, I certainly will be next year. Certain other unhappy Carp Society members have assured me they are already planning to find ways of having more say in the way the Society is run. If this is true or just hot air I can't say. if it is, I wish them all the luck in their quest.

dodger&diver

Accurate... Who actually benefits if the CS folds... that is the question.... Look and analyse....

You must be David then trying to defend the C.S

Quote

Under the current committee as a national carp organisation the Carp Society has ceased to exist. It is a pointless exercise members voting with their pockets because by their actions the committee have made it clear that they are not interested in the members or the Carp Society as an ideal. In fact I think it would suit them down to the ground if every member left and they could burry the Carp Society for good. What they wanted and what they got was Horseshoe Lake.

I think you've hit the nail on the head Andy Jack. Thats why there now saying to full permit holders (some long standing) who even dare to question their running of Horseshoe "If you don't like it, go elseware" It would suite them down to the ground to get rid of all the full permit holders and only issue 24 hour tickets.

Quote

Accurate... Who actually benefits if the CS folds... that is the question.... Look and analyse....

Another brilliant observation from Pete B, can anyone answer that question?

see you true colours have come out david

dodger & diver,
are you even a member of the cs? if not you need to join before you can go to agm,if you even know where they are held!. I get the feeling you dont know the history with Paul & cs,just jumping on band wagon because it looks good with all his other sheep the fellow him!

mixer...

I have been around carp fishing for over 30 years, my involvement in carp and specimen angling pre-dates the carp society, I have been involved with club committees and national organisations (National association of Specialist anglers as an RO) I watched the CS grow into a fully representative body for carp anglers with regional meetings, a good magazine, organised shows and a national presence... it now has none of the above and is, at best, a local angling club with paid officials... You seem to be defending this decline... I wonder why?

As you know so much about the current CS set up, answer the question... where do the assets go in the event of the CS folding?? just curious you understand...

If that question gets answered I will eat my socks and pull a copy of the memorandum and articles of incorporation of the Carp Society Limited from Companies house to check the answer's validity...

I have a suspicion that I hope is totally unfounded...

To me Pete he's a tw&t and one of the ones who is gaining
Profits that's all they think about now
be the right time to escape

It has all gone rather quiet...

It sure as fella
how about that new and improved moon on a hard huyton Gaff
just don't want hook up tench show you some of snags and steep banks great for stalking but i bet you lose it

I would recommend everyone to join the Carp Society..... and stay a member.... you heard it here first....

Well done Pete B, you certaintly shut Mixer up, wonder why he's not replied to your questions, I've been waiting with baited breath,I would think by his registration joining date that he is a CS management clone. Interested in why you think everyone should join and stay a member?

Purely on the basis that (and I have not pulled the Mem & Arts from Cos House to verify this) that in the event of the dissolution of the society, the assets would be sold and shared out... now to whom I am not certain, but you've got to be a member to be in with a shout... What is Horseshoe and the others worth? don't know.... but divide by current membership numbers... do the sums as it were...

Maybe I'm just an old cynic and all is well with the world.. but I have done similar in buying and advising companies on acquisitions and disposals... maybe dwindling membership is the way to go for some... whilst building 'casual' income (day ticket)...

Just my thoughts... I could be way off mark and apologise if my inane ramblings upset anyone...

But... if I am in anyway correct...

" If upon the winding-up or dissolution of the Company there
remains,after the satisfaction of all its debts and liabilities,
any property whatsoever,the same shall not be distributed among
the members,but shall be given to some other body having similar
objects to those of the Company "

Is that verbatim?, if so there must be further clarification as that is way too open ended. Should objects be objectives? even so it may as well stop at 'not be distributed among the members'

Is Horseshoe a Carp society asset?

My memory could be faulty, but I am sure that I remember reading that it had been set up as a seperate company? Something to do with protecting it in the event of the society getting into financial problems.

Is that right, or did I dream it or something?

The information I have quoted and the answer to your question
Andy, all lie within the Public Domain....Access to Companies
House is not required..just a visit to the Carp Society's
own website.

Winding up is covered under Clause 7 of the Memorandum of
Association...members may also be interested in Clause 6 .....

Article 3.3 of the current constitution as the aims of the Carp Society...

To organise national AND REGIONAL MEETINGS...

What a joke.....when was the last regional meeting held..three years ago?

And to quote David Mannall, "We (sic) found these were more trouble than they are worth (i.e.£ pound)..."

never been a member and never will be,but it sounds to me like sum people are making a lot of £s for doin very little...any chance of a job?

Unless you're related to David Mannal you've got no chance mate...

His wife - well known in the website design industry LOL - put the new 'dynamic' website together...

Still I hear Horseshoe is overrun with rats nowadays, which is a sure sign of poor fishery management...so if you're in pest control you've got a chance...

Long time since I posted on here but you are right Paul they do have a serious rat problem at present and don't seem too keen on doing anything about it all too comfortably holed up in the 'Center of Excellence'!
The little sods are quite prepared to come inside your bivvy nowadays needless to say I'm a shade less than impressed.

Seems to be a few in the 'Centre of Excellence'as well?

Tut tut Billy

Yeah theres Rats....course,every other lake in the UK is Rat free rolmfao.

I have seen a lot more in previous years up there....you lot just crack me up

One of the most famous lakes in the country for spodding,and you lot think Rats wont get attracted

“Now that we have responded to both last-years' annual permit holders and our waiting lists, there are still a limited number of permits available on both waters“.

Wonder how many limited is?

I think this shows what a good web site it is. Farriers is having major problems with the weed this year, with responsible anglers being unable to fish the place. Would you not think the CS would notify everyone via their website of this problem?
The same goes for Horseshoe, when swims are closed, why don't they notify everyone of the swims that are shut. Some anglers travel hundreds of miles to fish their favourite swims only to find them closed.
The same goes to the nets issue, why did they not inform people that they were experiencing problems with the lack of nets on the net (pun not intended). They were telling anglers to use their own nets. Great if you have travelled from Manchester without one because they are banned?
Why don’t they issue a daily count of anglers who are fishing Horseshoe. As an example, at 12 noon on Friday***** there are ** anglers fishing. This would save anglers travelling hundreds of miles for a wasted journey if the place is packed.
I’m sure there are other things the members would like to see on the site, why not try asking them, they could if they had a FORUM?
The site is updated once in a blue moon, I believe the last bit of news was "Lake closurss for Special Events" and that was ages ago.
As taken from their website.
"Welcome to the News Pages of the Carp Society website. These pages will feature Catch Reports from our venues, as well as important information on the angling scene"

Not a lot happening then?

I notice it's been updated to distance themselves a tad more from Redmire Pool. I wonder why...?

A Forum? Fat chance, they shut the last one down (the excellent Horseshoe Forum) because the Directors (sic) can't cope with well-founded criticism.....

By the way what is the 'Centre of Excellence' excellent in - bacon butties?

Nick have rats always been a problem on Horseshoe?

kind regards Jeff

Rats should never be a problem on any fishery, Jaffa.

You spend some money on poison and apply it correctly.....

And they do....come on paul,there are no rat free lakes in the UK...you kill them,others come in.

Get over it Paul...i hear your banned from other places too lol and you dont go on & on & on & on about them do you???

You carry on slagging them off for all i care...i know they dont give a flyer about you.

Jeff...dont bother

There are no rats on the Mangrove or Birch Grove, or my lakes in France, Nick....

At the first sight of a single rat the poison goes down and stays down until none are seen again. They don't 'keep coming' as you claim, because you wipe out the colonies.....

It's called good fishery management of which you have no experience.

Now I hear the punters at Horseshoe have to bring their own mats and nets with them, because so many have disappeared. Again poor management, but blamed on the members....

spot on , a couple of traps set around your bivvy at night also helps clear them quick .

Just a simple question Nick, nothing more and nothing less.

kind regards Jeff

Still going on Paul.You know the reasons as to why your no longer a mamber of cs,time to tell rest f your clowns the truth or shut up.If you decide to carry on we will see you in court.

"If you decide to carry on we will see you in court"

Bit harsh;)

kind regards Jeff

I understand there is no policy for the control of rodents at Horseshoe. Apparently they have the poison bait but no one to put the stuff down, they keep pissing off their helpers who leave. Any attempts to control the problem are half hearted and only applied to favourite swims i.e. Winter Point, Disabled Point and other favoured swims. Wonder why it’s only these swims?

As for "I know they don’t give a flyer about you" Whom do they give a flyer for then? They certainly don’t care about the regular anglers who are not renewing their annual permits. There use to be a smashing gang of anglers fishing Horseshoe, which the Carp Society has destroyed through their dictatorship approach and their inept lack of listening to what the members want. Go there for the first time and you get all the hype, on what a great club house they have built, I even bet you will get a guided tour and be shown the plasma television, underwater camera’s and state of the art kitchen, which all cost thousands. They seem to give the impression its theirs, but who paid for it all, the members. Yes, it is very impressive, (it should be for £500,000 plus), but that that money could have been spent on a more adequate building for a great deal less. Bet you don't get a quided tour on what they have done to the fishery.
Or would you rather your money have been spent on a proper road around the site with more parking areas to make access to the swims better, or proper made up swims that are level and properly lined, or some money spent on an improved perimeter fence, not like at present which anyone can obtain access through, or toilets at the far end of the lake, even if its Portaloo’s. (Forgive spelling), or an annual budgeted weed control policy, or a better security system for entering and leaving the fishery, or a FREE Junior Carp Camp, they must be able to get sponsors to finance it, after all the members give up their time free. Oh silly me, if they did that, they wouldn’t make any money out of the kids and make a profit at their expense, and that I find disgusting. There are loads more things I can think of and I bet you can, the list is endless. As that well known saying goes “I know they don’t give a flyer about you”.

Ops. does this mean I'll end up in court for telling the truth? Still the truth hurts!

Yes in the Mix, it will always go on until you stop betraying not just your own constitution, but the aims for which the Society has historically stood...

You may bleat on about Horseshoe now, but NONE OF YOU was involved with it's purchase, whatsover, and most of you were not even CS members when we did buy it for the Society...

Please take me to court!!!! The witnesses I shall call in my defence will include Tim Paisley, Derek Stritton, Nev Fickling, Mike Kavanagh, John Seal, Alan Atkins, Richard Stangroom, Mike Winstone, Tony Keoghane, Ritchie McDonald, Les Bamford, Micky Sly, Richard Stangroom amongst many others...

Hey In the Mix
I always thought you were a working CS clone,it just did not adder up,are you now the offical press officer for the CS. Did you really mean to call Paul a mamber (snake). Not very nice is it? Hope he doesn't take you to court for calling him that. When you start threatening court, who knows what vipers might come out and bite you. It sounds like your lukeing, sorry losing the plot. Very boa ing, hope to get a reply asp!

Mixer.... you seem well knowledgeable about the CS, past and present... Care to answer one question then...

What happens to the proceeds of the Carp Society's assets in the event of a voluntary dissolution?....

It really is not that hard to answer is it... it must be contained in the company's memorandum and articles of association, surely?

I don't give a flying about Paul and his 'problem or not' with the CS... I have one question and that is all... care to answer it....

hey In the Mix
Answer me a question: Is Horseshoe Lake just a business under the name of “The Carp Society” and does it take fully into account what the members want rather than are dictated to? If the question is too difficult, you can ask your friend.

As a follow on: Would the Carp Society consider postal voting to ALL its members on ALL major issue’s, like the Building of the Lodge, Splitting Summer Bay Away From the Main Lake, Nominating and Voting for Directors, and any proposals put forward for the AGM. With members from all over the country, they are not going to attend an AGM which sometimes last thirty minutes; you know that and take advantage of it. If you really represent the members it should not be a problem.

hey In the Mix

I forgot to ask, how many current Carp Society members are there? You must have access to this information? All the best.

Post deleted by Paul Selman

Blimey, I though the picture was Clive Owden, only joking!

I really think it's time to let this all go where it belongs "in the past" the CS was great in it's day and I was a proud member, the mag was good as were the meetings but carp angling was different then.
Carp fishing mags were few and far between so it was worth being a member just for the mag and the meetings were a good laugh, but things have now changed so much that the old style CS could not cope with the commercial competition there is these days unless it did much more for it's members.
The current CS pretty well is just Horseshoe inc and in the end of the day just another fishery.
It seems dodgey how it ended up that way but it looks like there is no way of getting it back to what it was.

Has anyone thought about a fresh start ?? A national group with regions that look after themselves offering more than just a mag, lease waters for the group as so many people moan about most of the club waters being run by match anglers in their 90's ! also get the meetings going again which plenty of people would attend, just look at the last few Manchester meetings put on by Roger and Jamie ! Rammed out.

If we can do it in Scotland with just a few hundred members just think what you could do in the North West with thousands ??

Cheers
Saul

It's not that simple, Saul...political involvement is more important than rammed out socials and talks...

Horseshoe was purchased by Carp Society members on the basis that it was to be the future making of a truly national carp organisation, with regions, publications, conferences, websites and major political clout and involvement...

That is STILL set out in the Constitution/Memorandum of Association call it what you will of the current administration.
Yet the current Directors are failing in their own duties, and see Horseshoe and it's 'Centre of Excellence' as the be all and end all, yet they cannot manage the lake properly despite £40,000 being paid out in salaries...

This is a carp world fishing scandal...

Post deleted by Paul Selman

Hey! Want to put something back into Carp Fishing?

Think you'd like to be part of something that promises to benefit Carp Anglers everywhere?

Then read on......I've got a great idea.

I think everybody on here should club together and buy me a lake that we can all fish. I'll then promise to completely disregard any of your wishes and whore myself and my lake about taking it hard up the arse in the pursuit of the corporate dollar.

Please send all CASH donations to me personally at http://www.TheCarpClub/stealallyourmoneyforourowngain.co.uk

Thanks.

they cannot manage the lake properly despite £40,000 being paid out in salaries

Agree with you there Paul, but how do you think the members can get the Carp Society back, there are loads of ex members who want it returned to its true value's.

There's nothing anyone can do because these people created an undemocratic structure to prevent anyone, even their own members from challenging their positions.

If just a handful of members more had been at the AGM three years ago none of this would have happened. I wasn't allowed to rejoin (unconstitutionally I made add, I wasn't allowed a hearing) and neither was Simon Crow if I recall...just those two votes would have been enough....

Short of someone stumping up the money for a legal challenge or a massive press campaign, which won't happen because of Sandown, they are there and will continue to be there...

It’s quite clear that the Carp Society is a despotic regime who regularly carries out corrupt elections and gag those with the best intentions for the future of carp fishing. Those concerned with the running of the free press should be applauded for their brave, almost foolhardy, stance against this irresistible colossus. You guys, you crazy dreamers… my heart goes out to you I’m typing this through tear streaked eyes. What are we going to do? Surely we can’t let this slip through our fingers, not now, not now we’re almost there, wherever there is.

Didn’t the C.A.A. become remote from the zeitgeist of the day and so give birth the now aging/ becoming irrelevant C.S.? Things are born, they’re your beautiful baby, everything’s possible, you want the best for them and then they start hanging round with the wrong crowd. This is just business, the C.S. is a business. I imagine there’s plenty of business around that are now unrecognizable from their initial mission statement. Get over it or if there’s enough demand do what the C.S. did and form a brave new word/alternative and let people vote with their feet. By now there are people pulling a wage out of the C.S. who want to protect their jobs. Gone are the enthusiastic unpaid armatures and in have come the bean counters. By making carp fishing sooo accessible a lot of high profile anglers are now bemoaning the monster they helped create.

Now that the CS has a spokesman, In the Mix, why haven't you answered the questions put to you?

Your sooooooooooo far away with your assumption of who in the mix is,billy.....your making yourself look nearly as silly as old Paul has

You were up there asses when your fishing was free,billy...now they have upset you because you have got lazy and stopped doing as much volunteer work as you were doing before Luke was taken on

After the NI & tax is taken away,the pay is no more than £40000 between two who do over 40 hours a week.

Anyone know a mr gardener or garner...Paul??

It's clear to see you're protecting your fishing perks at Horseshoe, Nick.....

I'll let others comment on the £40,000 net in wages being paid... Forty hours of what?

Quote from In the Mix to Paul "If you decide to carry on we will see you in court". So who is this person Nick, he must be pretty high up in the Carp Society, to be able to issue a statement like this.

£40,000, and we are paying for it.

Like Dave Breame's reply to you on Fat Carp, are you going to wipe it off?

Nick I see you didn't have the guts to leave Dave Breame's reply to you on Fat Carp, wonder why. So I've copied it before you deleted it and will show everyone what he said under a new post. Horseshoe. Shame you got billy wrong

You are him!!!!

And one of the mods removed it before i had even come home from work...get over it mate

whatever!

I'll let others comment on the £40,000 net in wages being paid... Forty hours of what?

Not bad money for running what is now just a glorified syndicate

Yeah OK ron :D...happy to go down and fish the other year though hey

Looks like billys burnt himself out on this one.

Byeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

So why don't you or In the Mix answer the questions put to you Nick? If you were more open, perhaps the members would be less inclined to have a go at the CS. You would think a publicity officer or spokesman (unpaid) would be an asset, to answer member’s questions and concerns. The CS like to make an issue of money leaving the society in the past though the back door and slagging off the likes of Tim Paisley etc, but money still is leaving, now its called wages and expenses, even though no one knows how much. What’s the difference? Surely you and all other paying members have a fundamental right to know how much?
One of the questions I asked Nick was "Would the Carp Society consider postal voting to ALL its members on ALL major issue’s, like the Building of the Lodge, Splitting Summer Bay Away From the Main Lake, Nominating and Voting for Directors, and any proposals put forward for the AGM". If they honestly had member’s interest at heart and with members all over the country, why can't they answer a simple question like this? They could be the best society/organisation in the country, if only they were more democratic and listened to the membership more, is that to much to ask Nick?